RE: [Turbo-List] Hypernova Blast Shipped

From Seavey <xxxxxx@optonline.net>
Date
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Isn=E2=80=99t Street Fighter 2 bigger than 1 megabit?  Is that HuCard =
limit for US-based systems or did SF2 do some crazy magic?  Or do I =
simply not know about HuCard design enough? J

=20

I could have sworn SF2 was 20 Megabits on PCE?

=20

Matt

=20

From: xxxxxx@gmail.com [mailto:xxxxxx@gmail.com] On Behalf Of bt =
garner
Sent: Monday, September 08, 2014 10:10 AM
To: Seavey
Cc: xxxxxx@link.st
Subject: Re: [Turbo-List] Hypernova Blast Shipped

=20

HNB has 8 separate overlays, the main game is really close to the 256K =
limit (so close in fact that at one point some code clean up had to be =
done to prevent it from going over).  All combined, the overlays are =
just under the 8 megabit limit that your standard HuCard has.  Now keep =
in mind that some of this is the non-SCD card warning, and some of this =
is overhead that would be present in every overlay, but not needed for a =
ROM image,  There are also a few hidden things (I've said too much) that =
could be removed.

In exchange, you'd have to add chiptune music to replace the CD tunes.

So, yes, it could be done with HNB to create an under 1 megabit version =
of the game suitable for HuCard/ROM/whatever.

-bt

=20

On Mon, Sep 8, 2014 at 9:44 AM, Seavey <xxxxxx@optonline.net> wrote:

I would imagine something like that would have a =E2=80=9Cminimum =
order=E2=80=9D too, just like the SCD runs do.  I wonder what that =
minimum would be, how much prototypes would cost for testing, etc etc.  =
As cool as it would be, what I=E2=80=99ve come to realize in talking =
with some folks recently is that there are too few people who =
=E2=80=9Csupport developers=E2=80=9D and buy games at full price or =
games they like the concept of but have no realistic time/chance of =
actually playing.  Most folks wait for a sale at Walmart or simply pass =
up anything but Madden and Call of Duty.  Given the cost of HuCard type =
production, which I=E2=80=99m guessing is high, and taking into account =
the size of the audience =E2=80=93 then factor in how many people would =
actually buy a TG16 game for $60+ (especially if they already bought the =
SCD version) and you have a losing scenario financially.

=20

I think it would be super-cool to see it done, but I don=E2=80=99t know =
that even on this list we could gather enough support to make it =
practical, and those on this list are the most hard-core fans J

=20

What about those HuCards that allow you to put a bunch of ROMs on one =
card?  I picked mine up when a lister years ago made a bulk order.  As I =
don=E2=80=99t have many ROMs I don=E2=80=99t use it much but something =
like that would let you play a game on an Express if it were in HuCard =
size/format without the expense of producing them as an official HuCard =
title.

=20

@BT =E2=80=93 music aside, could the game code fit into a HuCard-sized =
ROM that would work in a setup like this?  I don=E2=80=99t know how =
you=E2=80=99d make money on that yet but I=E2=80=99m just curious if it =
is technically possible?

=20

Matt (aka Landis)

=20

From: xxxxxx@gmail.com [mailto:xxxxxx@gmail.com] On Behalf Of bt =
garner
Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2014 6:49 PM
To: xxxxxx@link.st
Subject: Fwd: [Turbo-List] Hypernova Blast Shipped

=20

=20

Well, I think it boils down to simple economics.  Look at the 2 most =
recent PCE releases.  Atlantean was recently released on a custom built =
HuCard format, price is $60.  HNB on SCD sells for half that.  Now think =
about hardware, how many TG-16s and Duos are out there that are still =
functioning (and hooked up)?  Those are the only machines that can play =
a HuCard game.  Whereas an SCD can be played in any emulator or Duo =
(yeah, I know, no TG-16s for that).  Then you have the piracy issue.  If =
you released a PCE game on a format that could easily be uploaded, it =
will be uploaded (I have no doubt that HNB will be uploaded at some =
point too).

I am not saying it can't happen, but it just seems very unlikely that =
anyone would invest the time needed for a PCE release, then do what they =
can to not be able to recover the costs (and by costs I mean the costs =
of the product, that is not including the development costs).

-bt

=20

=20

On Sun, Sep 7, 2014 at 5:58 PM, Steve <xxxxxx@craftsathome.net> wrote:


I understand the ease and utility of using CD as a distribution medium, =
and also the flexibility in background music that a CD affords to a =
game. However, in these days of micro/mini SD cards, would it be "worth =
it" to distribute games on some kind of pseudo-Hucards with an SD card =
baked in? I would love to play new games on my Express as well as my =
Duo.

Thanks.

--
Sent from my Intellivision keyboard component.



> On Sep 7, 2014, at 3:14 PM, bt garner <xxxxxx@mindrec.com> wrote:
>
> Yo guys - the first batch of HNB CDs

[snip]

=20

=20

=20


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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue =
vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Isn=E2=80=99t Street Fighter 2 bigger than 1 megabit?=C2=A0 Is that =
HuCard limit for US-based systems or did SF2 do some crazy magic?=C2=A0 =
Or do I simply not know about HuCard design enough? </span><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:#1F497D'>J</span><s=
pan =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>I could have sworn SF2 was 20 Megabits on =
PCE?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Matt<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span>=
</b><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> =
xxxxxx@gmail.com [mailto:xxxxxx@gmail.com] <b>On Behalf Of </b>bt =
garner<br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, September 08, 2014 10:10 AM<br><b>To:</b> =
Seavey<br><b>Cc:</b> xxxxxx@link.st<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: =
[Turbo-List] Hypernova Blast Shipped<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>HNB has 8 separate =
overlays, the main game is really close to the 256K limit (so close in =
fact that at one point some code clean up had to be done to prevent it =
from going over).&nbsp; All combined, the overlays are just under the 8 =
megabit limit that your standard HuCard has.&nbsp; Now keep in mind that =
some of this is the non-SCD card warning, and some of this is overhead =
that would be present in every overlay, but not needed for a ROM =
image,&nbsp; There are also a few hidden things (I've said too much) =
that could be removed.<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>In exchange, you'd have to add chiptune =
music to replace the CD tunes.<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>So, yes, it could be done with HNB to =
create an under 1 megabit version of the game suitable for =
HuCard/ROM/whatever.<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>-bt<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>On Mon, Sep 8, 2014 at 9:44 AM, Seavey &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:xxxxxx@optonline.net" =
target=3D"_blank">xxxxxx@optonline.net</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>I would imagine something like that would have a =E2=80=9Cminimum =
order=E2=80=9D too, just like the SCD runs do.&nbsp; I wonder what that =
minimum would be, how much prototypes would cost for testing, etc =
etc.&nbsp; As cool as it would be, what I=E2=80=99ve come to realize in =
talking with some folks recently is that there are too few people who =
=E2=80=9Csupport developers=E2=80=9D and buy games at full price or =
games they like the concept of but have no realistic time/chance of =
actually playing.&nbsp; Most folks wait for a sale at Walmart or simply =
pass up anything but Madden and Call of Duty.&nbsp; Given the cost of =
HuCard type production, which I=E2=80=99m guessing is high, and taking =
into account the size of the audience =E2=80=93 then factor in how many =
people would actually buy a TG16 game for $60+ (especially if they =
already bought the SCD version) and you have a losing scenario =
financially.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>I think it would be super-cool to see it done, but I don=E2=80=99t =
know that even on this list we could gather enough support to make it =
practical, and those on this list are the most hard-core fans =
</span><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:#1F497D'>J</span><o=
:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>What about those HuCards that allow you to put a bunch of ROMs on one =
card?&nbsp; I picked mine up when a lister years ago made a bulk =
order.&nbsp; As I don=E2=80=99t have many ROMs I don=E2=80=99t use it =
much but something like that would let you play a game on an Express if =
it were in HuCard size/format without the expense of producing them as =
an official HuCard title.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>@BT =E2=80=93 music aside, could the game code fit into a =
HuCard-sized ROM that would work in a setup like this?&nbsp; I =
don=E2=80=99t know how you=E2=80=99d make money on that yet but =
I=E2=80=99m just curious if it is technically =
possible?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Matt (aka Landis)</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span>=
</b><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> =
<a href=3D"mailto:xxxxxx@gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">xxxxxx@gmail.com</a> [mailto:<a =
href=3D"mailto:xxxxxx@gmail.com" =
target=3D"_blank">xxxxxx@gmail.com</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>bt =
garner<br><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, September 07, 2014 6:49 PM<br><b>To:</b> =
<a href=3D"mailto:xxxxxx@link.st" =
target=3D"_blank">xxxxxx@link.st</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Fwd: =
[Turbo-List] Hypernova Blast Shipped</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>&nbsp;<o:p><=
/o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p><=
/p><div><div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Well, I think it =
boils down to simple economics.&nbsp; Look at the 2 most recent PCE =
releases.&nbsp; Atlantean was recently released on a custom built HuCard =
format, price is $60.&nbsp; HNB on SCD sells for half that.&nbsp; Now =
think about hardware, how many TG-16s and Duos are out there that are =
still functioning (and hooked up)?&nbsp; Those are the only machines =
that can play a HuCard game.&nbsp; Whereas an SCD can be played in any =
emulator or Duo (yeah, I know, no TG-16s for that).&nbsp; Then you have =
the piracy issue.&nbsp; If you released a PCE game on a format that =
could easily be uploaded, it will be uploaded (I have no doubt that HNB =
will be uploaded at some point too).<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'>I am not saying =
it can't happen, but it just seems very unlikely that anyone would =
invest the time needed for a PCE release, then do what they can to not =
be able to recover the costs (and by costs I mean the costs of the =
product, that is not including the development =
costs).<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'color:#888888'>-bt</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p><=
/p></div></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p><=
/p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>On Sun, Sep =
7, 2014 at 5:58 PM, Steve &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:xxxxxx@craftsathome.net" =
target=3D"_blank">xxxxxx@craftsathome.net</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>I understand =
the ease and utility of using CD as a distribution medium, and also the =
flexibility in background music that a CD affords to a game. However, in =
these days of micro/mini SD cards, would it be &quot;worth it&quot; to =
distribute games on some kind of pseudo-Hucards with an SD card baked =
in? I would love to play new games on my Express as well as my =
Duo.<br><br>Thanks.<br><br>--<br>Sent from my Intellivision keyboard =
component.<br><br><br><br>&gt; On Sep 7, 2014, at 3:14 PM, bt garner =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:xxxxxx@mindrec.com" =
target=3D"_blank">xxxxxx@mindrec.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>&gt;<br>&gt; Yo guys =
- the first batch of HNB CDs<br><br>[snip]<o:p></o:p></p></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>&nbsp;<o:p><=
/o:p></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>&nbsp;<o:p><=
/o:p></p></div></div></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div></div></body></html>=

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